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Asking People to Leave Church

Donald Miller wonders when it's OK and right to ask congregants to move on.

A couple times at a church here in Portland, the lead pastor has very kindly asked people to leave. I remember a specific time he just stood up and asked how many people had been coming to church for a year or more but hadn’t found a way to plug into the community. He then invited them to plug in (which at this church means to serve or find a home group or work in a ministry), and then told them if they hadn’t found a place that fit them, it might be time to try another church. It sounds rude, and the pastor wasn’t making anybody feel guilty—he just needed the chairs. He didn’t want to have to preach another service. The next week, there was a slight drop in attendance which freed up some chairs. I always admired that about this pastor.

To be clear, he hadn’t given up on them. And to be more clear, he hadn’t asked them to leave the Church (capital-C). What he was doing was leading; he was saying “this is where this community is going, where God has called us to go, and there may be other churches that God has called to just preach sermons and have people come and listen, perhaps doing ministry outside the community.” This pastor felt very strongly that the sermons, and even Sunday morning, weren’t what defined the church he had planted, but rather it was the act of “doing” work “together.”

Perhaps I admire this for the wrong reasons. Perhaps I get a bit tired of the unwritten rule of be as absolutely friendly to everybody as you can, nearly kissing up to them. I wonder if that doesn’t make a group of people spoiled. That idea is certainly debatable. My “black and white thinking” readers will see it as one way or another, but I think this is largely contextual. And it’s also a matter of calling for each church, perhaps.

There are other church leaders who, perhaps lacking in maturity, are just offensive. They talk like shock jocks, like slightly cleaned-up Howard Sterns, offending people and polarizing communities into people who are “with us” and “against us” (interestingly, this characteristic has been said to come from having been personally abused, needing to know who will submit to me and who won’t in order to feel safe) but this really isn’t what I’m talking about.

I think we are often afraid to say to somebody “You know, you don’t fit” because we might hurt them, so we get into relationships (and church is all about relationships) that simply aren’t right. We do this instead of helping people move on to a relationship that is right for them.

The truth is, there may be some people who simply aren’t a fit. It’s not that they are bad, it’s just that they aren’t really contributing anything, either because they haven’t been provided with a way for them to contribute (poor leadership) or because the system is allowing them to hang on as a pariah. Either way, something has to change, or else your church will become a place people come in order to be entertained.

Another pastor friend of mine planted a church several years ago. It was an offshoot of another church that was rightly falling apart due to divisions and lack of leadership. About 150 people came to that first meeting, and my friend stood up and asked everybody to really think about why they were there. He said that if anybody had come there with torches, with an axe to grind against the old church, to please leave. He didn’t want to build a reactionary church filled with people who were against something. He wanted to build a church filled with people who are for something, instead. The next week, only 50 people showed up. Years later, though, his church is healthy and vibrant and, well, quite large.

So what do you think? Are churches supposed to be warm and inviting to everybody, no matter what, or is it OK to identify people who just need to move on and find something else that fits them better? What’s your feeling about this? Aren’t there people in your church who, quite honestly, just need to move on?

This article originally appeared on Donald Miller's blog.

178 Comments

81,183

Dbrh57 commented…

one is making the assumption that church as we know it is actually how it is supposed to be done. I'd say remove the man-made bricks of our perception of "church" and people will stop going to buildings once a week to get their heaven ticket punched and will start LIVING with others daily in a way that makes "church" look like the false idol that it is.

81,183

Leigh commented…

This is so unscriptural, I can't even begin to address it. We have no right to ask anyone to leave a church unless it is under the most dire circumstances, such as those (very few) indicated in the bible. Where is there any biblical proof that we ask people to leave a church community for not "being involved"? This is a gross misuse of power - something that the church is very good at doing.

Jack Franicevich

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Jack Franicevich replied to 's comment

You bring up a good point. Consider, though, that Paul never addressed an area with multiple churches of multiple denominations in one town and no one carried in presuppositions about what Church ought to be. Everything was organic and the solution to most overcrowding problems was "start another one!"

The idea that people could attend a church gathering and not be involved in the community was foolishness to Paul and so he wrote no Biblical dictum that addressed this. The closest thing I can find to Paul wanting churches to cut ties with people who didn't really like the idea of church to begin with is in 2 Thess. 3. I'd like to hear what you think of what Paul says toward the end of that chapter.

Carrie Geren Scoggins

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Carrie Geren Scoggins replied to Jack Franicevich's comment

CONCERNING DONALD MILLER'S ARTICLE ON ASKING PEOPLE TO LEAVE THE CHURCH: I just read your article in "Relevent," about when it is ok to ask church members to leave. I saw how rude and ugly that truely is. If it were something of the effect of differences of opinion on issues that caused ongoing arguments, such as over if gay ministers are accepted in the church, or if they will perform a gay wedding, or something that is of major importance from a Biblical perspective, but over something so trivial, they need the seats to be filled with people they consider active there.... How horrifying! I was given my good bye at the Nashville Vineyard by the pastor Jerry Bryant of whom falsely accused me of witchcraft on the words of crooked cops illegaly coming into the church, violating sep. of church and state, keeping something stirred up against them there all the time. He never asks me if I am guilty, nor is there a change to clear my name there, he waits until prayer alter call to ruin my name in front of all there by saying they will not pray for me until I quit witchcraft. I left saying nothing to defend myself, I left hurt and angry with more than 2-3 years of my life waisted there. What a real jerk. I had seen him that service before downing someone in his sermon that he had accused of adultery, and oh how saddened by it he was... so he said. Not saddened enough to care about someone else's feelings of course. He had even come over and told Monica, a person from CTN, Christian channel that had been there and prayed for me to stop praying for me, whispering false accusations and slander into her ear right in front of me to embarrass me, and once before he gives an alter call for everyone to come up and be prayer for to be annointed for the ministry, and so when I go up to the ater I am the ony one that he singles out of the hundred up there to not want to pray for , with a looke of horror on his face as if I was the last person that he would pray for. I had notice mistreatment from the house group leader, Mark had mistreated me, and his wife acted like I could not be able to run a dance team there, as his wife Carenea /Karena sp? had also been violating my civil liberties listening to the illegal lies and slander from crooked cops coming into the church harassing me, violating sep. of church and state. I tithed the most there, off of the over 40 gold albums we had during that time period, and they prospered because of me. We had recorded Wynonna Judd, Marty Stewart, Kenny Rogers, and others while I went there, and to be treated like I was the trash of the land. I am an ordained minister from seminary. I have not yet confronted them with what they have done to me, but I can say that I quit church for good after it had happened at a few more churches. I would like my money back, and my sue. If you tell someone to leave you may steal their salvation, and they may never forgive, and will not forget, NEVER WILL THEY FORGET. I think that they have a legal right to be paid back the money they gave in as well. Obviously, that money will not be in the church "storehouse," for them, and it their money! The false accustions had come from my divorce hearings where I lost the money off of over 75 gold albums in all, and needed that prayer over being framed for witchcraft and mental illness in the divorce, which was fighting over music industry money. There are more churches that wronged me, all the same way, Smyrna Assembly, Family Worship Center, Nashville Vineyard, Christ Church, etc. almost all from lies and slander from law enforcement and their lying informants stalking me in the church. Just how rude I was treateted was unbelievable! Just look at the rotten fruit of telling a church member they are not welcome! How could you support this!

markus

1

markus commented…

I once belonged to a church the pastor asked several individuals to leave the church. from that point that ministry has never grew although the pastor has changed the name of the church over 8 times with in a 10 year period, all marriages in that ministry failed and no new ones was ever started. in other words the church became dead don't know if him asking people to leave or not had anything to do with it but, it sure seems as though it started right after that.

Jason Morris

1

Jason Morris commented…

This article pretty much lost my interest when it stated that the pastor simply needed the seats because he didn't want to have to preach another service. So, in reality, it's not so much that people weren't plugging in...it's more about congregational size control...and to be convenient for the pastors schedule. It's one thing to hold members accountable...but, I'm not sure that what this is about.

Steve Orris

1

Steve Orris commented…

Wow. What a topic.

I've been in two churches that have asked a pastor to leave. Neither had a good reason to do so. And in a third church I was asked to leave because I didn't support the pastor.

As to whether asking someone to leave is right or wrong I would say it very much depends on the circumstances. Every possible situation that could ever exist is not addressed in Scripture. We have guidelines to follow but not every detail of every church will be addressed in the Bible or we would have "Read your Bible through in a decade" programs.

I can understand the opinion that one should never ask someone to leave the church other than for unrepentant sin. But for now let's say there is a time and a place for everything and in a certain time and place someone should be asked to leave a particular local body of believers. There are dozens of wrong ways to go about it. And one right way.

Every effort should be made to work together first.
Gossip should never be a tool to effectively do the job without direct contact.
Creating an atmosphere that encourages people to leave should not be tolerated.
Personal opinions should not be a reason to "ask" someone to leave.

In my case, I was very "plugged in". But for some never-spoken reason the pastor wanted me gone. He never told me so. He just made me feel unwelcome, unwanted, unneeded, in the way. And then others started treating me differently as well. Something was very wrong there. I do not know the reasons or motives behind it all. Nor does it really matter. God will use every situation to change you into a more perfect reflection of His Son, if you let him. Satan will use every opportunity to destroy that image. Wherever you find yourself in this "debate" remember this:

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, and against the worldly governors, the princes of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness, which are in the high places.
__________________

I later heard a term that I think sums it up nicely if you want more info on this subject.

"Spiritual Abuse."
Google it. There are some good books about it.

OR

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